monitor model upload in Desktop Radiance

Dear all,

If at all possible, could you please help on that.

I'm in the process of modeling an office space in Desktop Radiance. Greg provided for me an accurate monitor model as part of the furnishing to be incorporated in this space. The monitor is a .rad file format. I didn't get the chance to insert the file in the cad system. I asked Greg about this and he doesn’t know enough about Desktop Radiance to advise me on how to incorporate the monitor in my model. Is there an advice that might help. The option of accessing the file using the furnishing folder in the radiance menu (by uploading the monitor in the library) didn't work.

Is there is an efficient way to upload the monitor into my Desktop Radiance model.

With thanks and you are much appreciated.

Respectfully,
Mohamad

Are you asking for a radiance to autocad geometry converter? That I know of, there are only tools for exporting TO radiance, not from. You might be better off either drawing your own cad furniture or downloading furniture off the internet. If you use the regular radiance, you could combine both exported cad geometry as well as radiance geometry (from some library) into your scene.

Mark

As I understand it, Mohamad is asking how to incorporate a model already in Radiance format into a Desktop Radiance scene. There must be a back door or some trick, but I don't know anything about DR.

-Greg

···

From: "Mark de la Fuente" <[email protected]>
Date: March 20, 2007 6:06:43 AM PDT

Are you asking for a radiance to autocad geometry converter? That I know of, there are only tools for exporting TO radiance, not from. You might be better off either drawing your own cad furniture or downloading furniture off the internet. If you use the regular radiance, you could combine both exported cad geometry as well as radiance geometry (from some library) into your scene.

Mark

From: Mohamad Tarek Araji <[email protected]>
Date: March 19, 2007 9:36:26 AM PDT

Dear all,

If at all possible, could you please help on that.

I'm in the process of modeling an office space in Desktop Radiance. Greg provided for me an accurate monitor model as part of the furnishing to be incorporated in this space. The monitor is a .rad file format. I didn't get the chance to insert the file in the cad system. I asked Greg about this and he doesn’t know enough about Desktop Radiance to advise me on how to incorporate the monitor in my model. Is there an advice that might help. The option of accessing the file using the furnishing folder in the radiance menu (by uploading the monitor in the library) didn't work.

Is there is an efficient way to upload the monitor into my Desktop Radiance model.

With thanks and you are much appreciated.

Respectfully,
Mohamad

Hi Mohamad,

I believe the best way to do this is by using a triangle marker in your desktop radiance scene and then using the replmarks command to replace that marker with the previously created Radiance monitor model. I don't think Desktop Radiance has a clean way to do this in the interface so you may have to add this to the created rif and rad files behind the scenes. This is a more complex process and I would suggest reading the Radiance manual pages on rif and rad formats and on replmarks.

Regards,
Zack

Zack Rogers, P.E., IESNA, LEED AP
Daylighting Analysis Group Leader
Architectural Energy Corporation
2540 Frontier Avenue, Suite 201
Boulder, CO 80301 USA

tel (303)444-4149 ext. 435
fax (303)444-4304

···

-----Original Message-----
From: Gregory J. Ward [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 8:45 AM
To: Radiance general discussion
Subject: Re: [Radiance-general] monitor model upload in Desktop Radiance

As I understand it, Mohamad is asking how to incorporate a model already in Radiance format into a Desktop Radiance scene. There must be a back door or some trick, but I don't know anything about DR.

-Greg

From: "Mark de la Fuente" <[email protected]>
Date: March 20, 2007 6:06:43 AM PDT

Are you asking for a radiance to autocad geometry converter? That I
know of, there are only tools for exporting TO radiance, not from.
You might be better off either drawing your own cad furniture or
downloading furniture off the internet. If you use the regular
radiance, you could combine both exported cad geometry as well as
radiance geometry (from some library) into your scene.

Mark

From: Mohamad Tarek Araji <[email protected]>
Date: March 19, 2007 9:36:26 AM PDT

Dear all,

If at all possible, could you please help on that.

I'm in the process of modeling an office space in Desktop Radiance.
Greg provided for me an accurate monitor model as part of the
furnishing to be incorporated in this space. The monitor is a .rad
file format. I didn't get the chance to insert the file in the cad
system. I asked Greg about this and he doesn't know enough about
Desktop Radiance to advise me on how to incorporate the monitor in my
model. Is there an advice that might help. The option of accessing the
file using the furnishing folder in the radiance menu (by uploading
the monitor in the library) didn't work.

Is there is an efficient way to upload the monitor into my Desktop
Radiance model.

With thanks and you are much appreciated.

Respectfully,
Mohamad

_______________________________________________
Radiance-general mailing list
[email protected]
http://www.radiance-online.org/mailman/listinfo/radiance-general

The general procedure that I would use is to run Desktop Radiance first without the monitor in the scene and then to modify the files that Desktop Radiance has produced to include the .rad file for the monitor. If the .rad file for the monitor represents a monitor already positioned at the right location in the scene (and of the right dimensions) then one simply has to add the following line in the .rif file:
scene = monitor.rad and to add the monitor.rad file to the list of rad files that Desktop Radiance has already produced
Assuming the file is called monitor.rad

If the monitor is not scaled correctly and/or not positioned correctly, then one must convert the monitor.rad file to an octree first by typing the line, oconv monitor.rad > monitor.oct, at the command prompt.
Next you need to create a new .rad file with this octree to position and scale the monitor correctly. This new text file would have the following lines:
void instance monitor1
13 monitor.oct -s 1.0000 -rz 0.00000 -rx 0.0000 -ry 0.0000 - t 0.0000 0.0000 0.0000
0

where the number after the -s represents the scale factor
the numbers after the -rz, -rx, -ry represent the rotations (probably in degrees)
and the three numbers after the -t represent the x,y,z translation of the monitor to the right location in the scene
This new rad file should then be included with the list of rad files that Desktop Radiance has already included and, as above, the following line should be added to the rif file:
scene = monitornew.rad
where monitornew.rad is the new rad file.
In order to do this you will, of course, need to find out where Desktop Radiance stored the files it created.
Lastly, after you have made all these changes, you need to run Radiance from the command line rather than from the Desktop Radiance menu.
In know this sounds a bit complicated but only if you are doing it for the first time. You do this by clicking on the last .bat file that Desktop Radiance created.

Thomas

···

On Mar 20, 2007, at 9:44 AM, Gregory J. Ward wrote:

As I understand it, Mohamad is asking how to incorporate a model already in Radiance format into a Desktop Radiance scene. There must be a back door or some trick, but I don't know anything about DR.

-Greg

From: "Mark de la Fuente" <[email protected]>
Date: March 20, 2007 6:06:43 AM PDT

Are you asking for a radiance to autocad geometry converter? That I know of, there are only tools for exporting TO radiance, not from. You might be better off either drawing your own cad furniture or downloading furniture off the internet. If you use the regular radiance, you could combine both exported cad geometry as well as radiance geometry (from some library) into your scene.

Mark

From: Mohamad Tarek Araji <[email protected]>
Date: March 19, 2007 9:36:26 AM PDT

Dear all,

If at all possible, could you please help on that.

I'm in the process of modeling an office space in Desktop Radiance. Greg provided for me an accurate monitor model as part of the furnishing to be incorporated in this space. The monitor is a .rad file format. I didn't get the chance to insert the file in the cad system. I asked Greg about this and he doesn’t know enough about Desktop Radiance to advise me on how to incorporate the monitor in my model. Is there an advice that might help. The option of accessing the file using the furnishing folder in the radiance menu (by uploading the monitor in the library) didn't work.

Is there is an efficient way to upload the monitor into my Desktop Radiance model.

With thanks and you are much appreciated.

Respectfully,
Mohamad

_______________________________________________
Radiance-general mailing list
[email protected]
http://www.radiance-online.org/mailman/listinfo/radiance-general

Hi all,

Thanks so much for your help. You are much appreciated.

Greg described my problem exactly right. Mark, I started by drawing my own furniture, but I realized that they won't have accurate photometric data. If there is a possible way to model accurate model in cad (Desktop Radiance), I'm totally open to this option. I master the work in the cad system.

Zack, I couldn’t find the replmarks command in Desktop Radiance. I think it's only available in Radiance. Am I right. Also, I don't know if the DR has the Triangular marker option to use. I read all the information available in the Radiance manual pages, but nothing helped on this issue with the DR.

Best regard.

Respectfully,
Mohamad

···

---- Original message ----

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2007 09:31:18 -0600
From: "Zack Rogers" <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: [Radiance-general] monitor model upload in Desktop Radiance
To: radiance-general <[email protected]>

Hi Mohamad,

I believe the best way to do this is by using a triangle marker in your desktop radiance scene and then using the replmarks command to replace that marker with the previously created Radiance monitor model. I don't think Desktop Radiance has a clean way to do this in the interface so you may have to add this to the created rif and rad files behind the scenes. This is a more complex process and I would suggest reading the Radiance manual pages on rif and rad formats and on replmarks.

Regards,
Zack

Zack Rogers, P.E., IESNA, LEED AP
Daylighting Analysis Group Leader
Architectural Energy Corporation
2540 Frontier Avenue, Suite 201
Boulder, CO 80301 USA

tel (303)444-4149 ext. 435
fax (303)444-4304
http://www.archenergy.com

-----Original Message-----
From: Gregory J. Ward [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 8:45 AM
To: Radiance general discussion
Subject: Re: [Radiance-general] monitor model upload in Desktop Radiance

As I understand it, Mohamad is asking how to incorporate a model already in Radiance format into a Desktop Radiance scene. There must be a back door or some trick, but I don't know anything about DR.

-Greg

From: "Mark de la Fuente" <[email protected]>
Date: March 20, 2007 6:06:43 AM PDT

Are you asking for a radiance to autocad geometry converter? That I
know of, there are only tools for exporting TO radiance, not from.
You might be better off either drawing your own cad furniture or
downloading furniture off the internet. If you use the regular
radiance, you could combine both exported cad geometry as well as
radiance geometry (from some library) into your scene.

Mark

From: Mohamad Tarek Araji <[email protected]>
Date: March 19, 2007 9:36:26 AM PDT

Dear all,

If at all possible, could you please help on that.

I'm in the process of modeling an office space in Desktop Radiance.
Greg provided for me an accurate monitor model as part of the
furnishing to be incorporated in this space. The monitor is a .rad
file format. I didn't get the chance to insert the file in the cad
system. I asked Greg about this and he doesn't know enough about
Desktop Radiance to advise me on how to incorporate the monitor in my
model. Is there an advice that might help. The option of accessing the
file using the furnishing folder in the radiance menu (by uploading
the monitor in the library) didn't work.

Is there is an efficient way to upload the monitor into my Desktop
Radiance model.

With thanks and you are much appreciated.

Respectfully,
Mohamad

_______________________________________________
Radiance-general mailing list
[email protected]
http://www.radiance-online.org/mailman/listinfo/radiance-general

_______________________________________________
Radiance-general mailing list
[email protected]
http://www.radiance-online.org/mailman/listinfo/radiance-general

---------------------------------------
Mohamad T. Araji
Ph.D. student
School of Architecture
The University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Temple Hoyne Buell Hall, MC-621
611 Taft Dr. Champaign, IL 61820
Office Tel: (217) 333-0538, (313) 903-4484, [email protected]

Hi Thomas,

Thank you so much for this detailed massage. I will follow all the enclosed steps and get back to you.

Respectfully,
Mohamad

···

---- Original message ----

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2007 12:11:20 -0500
From: Thomas Seebohm <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [Radiance-general] monitor model upload in Desktop Radiance
To: Radiance general discussion <[email protected]>

The general procedure that I would use is to run Desktop Radiance first
without the monitor in the scene and then to modify the files that
Desktop Radiance has produced to include the .rad file for the monitor.
If the .rad file for the monitor represents a monitor already
positioned at the right location in the scene (and of the right
dimensions) then one simply has to add the following line in the .rif
file:
scene = monitor.rad and to add the monitor.rad file to the list of
rad files that Desktop Radiance has already produced
Assuming the file is called monitor.rad

If the monitor is not scaled correctly and/or not positioned correctly,
then one must convert the monitor.rad file to an octree first by typing
the line, oconv monitor.rad > monitor.oct, at the command prompt.
Next you need to create a new .rad file with this octree to position
and scale the monitor correctly. This new text file would have the
following lines:
void instance monitor1
13 monitor.oct -s 1.0000 -rz 0.00000 -rx 0.0000 -ry 0.0000 - t 0.0000
0.0000 0.0000
0
0

where the number after the -s represents the scale factor
the numbers after the -rz, -rx, -ry represent the rotations (probably
in degrees)
and the three numbers after the -t represent the x,y,z translation of
the monitor to the right location in the scene
This new rad file should then be included with the list of rad files
that Desktop Radiance has already included and, as above, the following
line should be added to the rif file:
scene = monitornew.rad
where monitornew.rad is the new rad file.
In order to do this you will, of course, need to find out where Desktop
Radiance stored the files it created.
Lastly, after you have made all these changes, you need to run Radiance
from the command line rather than from the Desktop Radiance menu.
In know this sounds a bit complicated but only if you are doing it for
the first time. You do this by clicking on the last .bat file that
Desktop Radiance created.

Thomas
On Mar 20, 2007, at 9:44 AM, Gregory J. Ward wrote:

As I understand it, Mohamad is asking how to incorporate a model
already in Radiance format into a Desktop Radiance scene. There must
be a back door or some trick, but I don't know anything about DR.

-Greg

From: "Mark de la Fuente" <[email protected]>
Date: March 20, 2007 6:06:43 AM PDT

Are you asking for a radiance to autocad geometry converter? That I
know of, there are only tools for exporting TO radiance, not from.
You might be better off either drawing your own cad furniture or
downloading furniture off the internet. If you use the regular
radiance, you could combine both exported cad geometry as well as
radiance geometry (from some library) into your scene.

Mark

From: Mohamad Tarek Araji <[email protected]>
Date: March 19, 2007 9:36:26 AM PDT

Dear all,

If at all possible, could you please help on that.

I'm in the process of modeling an office space in Desktop Radiance.
Greg provided for me an accurate monitor model as part of the
furnishing to be incorporated in this space. The monitor is a .rad
file format. I didn't get the chance to insert the file in the cad
system. I asked Greg about this and he doesn’t know enough about
Desktop Radiance to advise me on how to incorporate the monitor in my
model. Is there an advice that might help. The option of accessing
the file using the furnishing folder in the radiance menu (by
uploading the monitor in the library) didn't work.

Is there is an efficient way to upload the monitor into my Desktop
Radiance model.

With thanks and you are much appreciated.

Respectfully,
Mohamad

_______________________________________________
Radiance-general mailing list
[email protected]
http://www.radiance-online.org/mailman/listinfo/radiance-general

_______________________________________________
Radiance-general mailing list
[email protected]
http://www.radiance-online.org/mailman/listinfo/radiance-general

Hi Thomas,

It was easy to follow all the steps you mentioned, expect for the one responsible on how to edit the scale/position of the monitor. The reason is that I wasn’t able to convert the .rad file to .oct file. Basically, I have three .rad files for the monitor, not one. I think one of them is responsible for the positioning/scaling factor, namely VDTon.rad. When typing in the command prompt (oconv VDTon.rad > VDTon.oct), I get error massage. I even tried the option of converting the other .vdt files to .oct, but I got similar/different error massages. Is there a problem that I’m not aware of.

I'm attaching these files for your convenience, especially if you are interested in taking a closer look.

Again, thank you so much for your help and you are much appreciated.

Respectfully,
Mohamad

VDTon.rad (309 Bytes)

VDThead.rad (8.46 KB)

VDTscreen_on.rad (655 Bytes)

···

---- Original message ----

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2007 12:11:20 -0500
From: Thomas Seebohm <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [Radiance-general] monitor model upload in Desktop Radiance
To: Radiance general discussion <[email protected]>

The general procedure that I would use is to run Desktop Radiance first
without the monitor in the scene and then to modify the files that
Desktop Radiance has produced to include the .rad file for the monitor.
If the .rad file for the monitor represents a monitor already
positioned at the right location in the scene (and of the right
dimensions) then one simply has to add the following line in the .rif
file:
scene = monitor.rad and to add the monitor.rad file to the list of
rad files that Desktop Radiance has already produced
Assuming the file is called monitor.rad

If the monitor is not scaled correctly and/or not positioned correctly,
then one must convert the monitor.rad file to an octree first by typing
the line, oconv monitor.rad > monitor.oct, at the command prompt.
Next you need to create a new .rad file with this octree to position
and scale the monitor correctly. This new text file would have the
following lines:
void instance monitor1
13 monitor.oct -s 1.0000 -rz 0.00000 -rx 0.0000 -ry 0.0000 - t 0.0000
0.0000 0.0000
0
0

where the number after the -s represents the scale factor
the numbers after the -rz, -rx, -ry represent the rotations (probably
in degrees)
and the three numbers after the -t represent the x,y,z translation of
the monitor to the right location in the scene
This new rad file should then be included with the list of rad files
that Desktop Radiance has already included and, as above, the following
line should be added to the rif file:
scene = monitornew.rad
where monitornew.rad is the new rad file.
In order to do this you will, of course, need to find out where Desktop
Radiance stored the files it created.
Lastly, after you have made all these changes, you need to run Radiance
from the command line rather than from the Desktop Radiance menu.
In know this sounds a bit complicated but only if you are doing it for
the first time. You do this by clicking on the last .bat file that
Desktop Radiance created.

Thomas
On Mar 20, 2007, at 9:44 AM, Gregory J. Ward wrote:

As I understand it, Mohamad is asking how to incorporate a model
already in Radiance format into a Desktop Radiance scene. There must
be a back door or some trick, but I don't know anything about DR.

-Greg

From: "Mark de la Fuente" <[email protected]>
Date: March 20, 2007 6:06:43 AM PDT

Are you asking for a radiance to autocad geometry converter? That I
know of, there are only tools for exporting TO radiance, not from.
You might be better off either drawing your own cad furniture or
downloading furniture off the internet. If you use the regular
radiance, you could combine both exported cad geometry as well as
radiance geometry (from some library) into your scene.

Mark

From: Mohamad Tarek Araji <[email protected]>
Date: March 19, 2007 9:36:26 AM PDT

Dear all,

If at all possible, could you please help on that.

I'm in the process of modeling an office space in Desktop Radiance.
Greg provided for me an accurate monitor model as part of the
furnishing to be incorporated in this space. The monitor is a .rad
file format. I didn't get the chance to insert the file in the cad
system. I asked Greg about this and he doesn’t know enough about
Desktop Radiance to advise me on how to incorporate the monitor in my
model. Is there an advice that might help. The option of accessing
the file using the furnishing folder in the radiance menu (by
uploading the monitor in the library) didn't work.

Is there is an efficient way to upload the monitor into my Desktop
Radiance model.

With thanks and you are much appreciated.

Respectfully,
Mohamad

_______________________________________________
Radiance-general mailing list
[email protected]
http://www.radiance-online.org/mailman/listinfo/radiance-general

_______________________________________________
Radiance-general mailing list
[email protected]
http://www.radiance-online.org/mailman/listinfo/radiance-general

---------------------------------------
Mohamad T. Araji
Ph.D. student
School of Architecture
The University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Temple Hoyne Buell Hall, MC-621
611 Taft Dr. Champaign, IL 61820
Office Tel: (217) 333-0538, (313) 903-4484, [email protected]

My memory of DR is very old, but I seem to remember that it had problems
with two issues:
1) TAB characters in the file - cannot remember if the xform program was
able to sort that one out.
2) The LF versus CR/LF end of line terminations.

I remember I had some fun trying to use the Unix developed models in the
MS/DR environment, eventually giving up and using Linux and the latest
Radiance. (Now I am using VMPLAYER to run the Linux/radiance and sharing
the hardware/file systems via samba - works a treat) - Just export your
CAD model using 3ds or dxf, copy it across to the Linux file system (via
samba), convert with 3ds2mgf + mgf2rad or the dxf2rad method. Then use
trad as a nice friendly gui to radiance.

Regards

Terry Mc Minn

Hmmm, as long as you got everything, you should be able to create the octree. How are you unpacking these files you got from Greg? Reason I ask is that Greg sent me that very same monitor model and I was able to work with it, but when I first tried to use it I got errors working on Windows. There are linefeed issues that can create some problems here, and I suspect that's your problem. I'd send you a frozen octree, but I can't seem to find the source files here on my laptop -- must all be at work (looks like I'm getting my priorities straight). If you like, I can build a frozen octree tomorrow and mail it to ya, and we can go from there.

- Rob

···

On Mar 20, 2007, at 4:58 PM, Mohamad Tarek Araji wrote:

Hi Thomas,

It was easy to follow all the steps you mentioned, expect for the one responsible on how to edit the scale/position of the monitor. The reason is that I wasn’t able to convert the .rad file to .oct file. Basically, I have three .rad files for the monitor, not one. I think one of them is responsible for the positioning/scaling factor, namely VDTon.rad. When typing in the command prompt (oconv VDTon.rad > VDTon.oct), I get error massage. I even tried the option of converting the other .vdt files to .oct, but I got similar/different error massages. Is there a problem that I’m not aware of.

Hi Rob,

Thanks so much for your help and you are much appreciated. It's great idea if you can create the octree files and forward those to me.

Best regards.

Respectfully,
Moamad

···

---- Original message ----

Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2007 22:45:08 -0600
From: Rob Guglielmetti <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [Radiance-general] monitor model upload in Desktop Radiance
To: Radiance general discussion <[email protected]>

On Mar 20, 2007, at 4:58 PM, Mohamad Tarek Araji wrote:

Hi Thomas,

It was easy to follow all the steps you mentioned, expect for the
one responsible on how to edit the scale/position of the monitor.
The reason is that I wasn’t able to convert the .rad file to .oct
file. Basically, I have three .rad files for the monitor, not one.
I think one of them is responsible for the positioning/scaling
factor, namely VDTon.rad. When typing in the command prompt (oconv
VDTon.rad > VDTon.oct), I get error massage. I even tried the
option of converting the other .vdt files to .oct, but I got
similar/different error massages. Is there a problem that I’m not
aware of.

Hmmm, as long as you got everything, you should be able to create the
octree. How are you unpacking these files you got from Greg? Reason
I ask is that Greg sent me that very same monitor model and I was
able to work with it, but when I first tried to use it I got errors
working on Windows. There are linefeed issues that can create some
problems here, and I suspect that's your problem. I'd send you a
frozen octree, but I can't seem to find the source files here on my
laptop -- must all be at work (looks like I'm getting my priorities
straight). If you like, I can build a frozen octree tomorrow and
mail it to ya, and we can go from there.

- Rob
_______________________________________________
Radiance-general mailing list
[email protected]
http://www.radiance-online.org/mailman/listinfo/radiance-general

---------------------------------------
Mohamad T. Araji
Ph.D. student
School of Architecture
The University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Temple Hoyne Buell Hall, MC-621
611 Taft Dr. Champaign, IL 61820
Office Tel: (217) 333-0538, (313) 903-4484, [email protected]

To add to Terry's observations.

If you prefer a single-platform/single-OS solution, then SketchUp -> Radiance on the Mac works very well. Export 3DS and convert to Radiance as described by Terry (or use the 3ds2rad script which you'll find on these pages somewhere).

-John

···

-----------------------------------------------
Dr. John Mardaljevic
Senior Research Fellow
Institute of Energy and Sustainable Development
De Montfort University
The Gateway
Leicester
LE1 9BH, UK
+44 (0) 116 257 7972
+44 (0) 116 257 7981 (fax)

[email protected]
http://www.iesd.dmu.ac.uk/~jm